Moments when a piece of entertainment completely lost you.

Username17 · Post by **Username17** » Sat Apr 27, 2013 4:34 pm

Whatever wrote:Fan fiction is an unauthorized derivative work. The fan authors have no rights. Zero, zip, nada. If it was authorized, and they had a contract, they'd have the right to whatever they added (but still no rights to the underlying characters). But it's not authorized, so the law specifically excludes them from having any copyright protection at all.

GRRM could take someone's Daenerys fan fiction straight from a website, slap his name on it, and publish it for the lulz, and almost certainly win in court (this happens in Hollywood approximately "all the time").

Now, certain fan fiction groups are working to fight this and get some rights as transformative works, so going to court means you might suddenly be their test case and have to face down a few dozen attorneys who are really passionate about reading and writing unauthorized fanfiction sex scenes. That's a deterrent for any author, so I can understand the impulse to avoid reading/taking from fan fiction. But not letting people "guess" your plot is super dumb.

Pretty much this.

I mean, JK Rowling got all weird and crazy about FanFiction authors writing stories in which Harry has sex with Ron or whatever because she thinks that is somehow people raping characters that she owns. She even wrote an incredibly bad "canonical ending" to show exactly who ends up marrying who and how many kids they have and what their names were and all that shit. And she tried to put an end to Harry Potter slashfics with legal challenges that slashfic authors obviously lacked the funds to go to court over.

But even she doesn't think that Harry Potter slashfic authors can sue her for making Dumbledore gay. That doesn't even make sense.

-Username17

Ancient History · Post by **Ancient History** » Sat Apr 27, 2013 4:38 pm

I think that goes back to Marion Zimmer Bradley, who actually had somebody try something like that.

Winnah · Post by **Winnah** » Mon Apr 29, 2013 10:49 am

Dr Who has become very disappointing with Moffat as lead writer and executive producer.

I want to compare him to Mike Mearls, but that would be unfair. Moffat has actually produced some brilliant work, despite his many failings.

I had thought that the addition of a new character would be a turning point for the series, but no, same shit...

The reset button makes another fucking appearence in the latest episode. How lazy is that? You have a 'sci-fi' franchise in which literally any kind of story can be told, but someone elects to resort to a cheap cop-out, again, rather than taking any risks with their writing.

I find that just slightly more insulting than the premise of the recent episode; Black people (...in space) will steal and break your stuff.

I don't know why I keep setting myself up for disappointment. I have sat through the deus ex machina endings, the "I'm the Doctor and I'm awesome" speeches, River 'Mary Sue' Song, Power Ranger Daleks and other trite, forgettable garbage...But I keep coming back. All because I remember when the show was often clever and exiting.

Perhaps it is the one hour format. Perhaps it is the effort to appeal to American television executives (as opposed to US television viewers). Perhaps there is even an effort by BBC executives to sell the production rights to the series...again. All I know is that I will not be setting aside my time to watch new episodes of this long running show any more.

PhoneLobster · Post by **PhoneLobster** » Mon Apr 29, 2013 12:58 pm

I had a conversation with someone about the new doctor's companion.

We were both disappointing that she didn't die every single episode.

A slightly more dedicated Dr Who buff in the room also suggested that the whole season ending big anniversary episode revolving around her didn't make sense or would be some sort of muddle. If the last season... and a half

are any indication I'll go with muddle.

Also fucking River Song is pretty much predetermined to be fucking back. Along with her fucking parents. I mean I'm hoping their failure to mention her at all is hurried rug brushing under, but... lets face it, she will be fucking back...

Prak · Post by **Prak** » Mon Apr 29, 2013 1:52 pm

PhoneLobster wrote:I had a conversation with someone about the new doctor's companion.

We were both disappointing that she didn't die every single episode.

I have to admit, I was a bit disappointed by that too.

Winnah wrote:Black people (...in space) will steal and break your stuff.

We are truly through the fucking looking glass if you're not allowed to cast black people as space salvage crew. Casting three black men as a family salvage company is not racist. Nor was that really the premise (certainly not their skin colour anyway).

Now, if the Tardis ran into a planet full of black people who salvaged broken space ships, I might buy your assertion.

Winnah · Post by **Winnah** » Mon Apr 29, 2013 4:41 pm

They were sci-fi car-jackers, prowling space lanes, looking for ships to ambush so that they could run them through an illegal chop shop.

Maybe that isn't especially racist, but I have not seen many non-white major characters since Davies was executive producer, so I tend to notice the diversity the few times it occurs.

And it was totally the premise of the show. The Doctor got his ride jacked because he let a woman operate the console for a second. Hijinks ensue.

Prak · Post by **Prak** » Mon Apr 29, 2013 5:03 pm

Sci-fi car jackers looking for abandoned space cars.

Was Davies EP when the useless boyfriend (who happened to be black) of Rose was popping up?

Winnah · Post by **Winnah** » Mon Apr 29, 2013 5:35 pm

sci-fi carjackers with an illegal, ship disabling beam weapon.

You'll also note that only the carjackers slave expressed any concern that there were people still alive on the TARDIS. The others just wanted to treat she ship as scrap.

I'll upgrade sci-fi carjacker to sci-fi murder hobo.

As for Mickey, he was not useless. The character developed over time.

Prak · Post by **Prak** » Mon Apr 29, 2013 5:39 pm

Really? Because Mickey seemed to sing the same "I'm useless and don't like that Rose is interested in another man" tune every time he showed up.

virgil · Post by **virgil** » Mon Apr 29, 2013 5:42 pm

I think Moffat suffers from a critical failure of being unable to follow through. I realized this when I watched his other series, Jekyll. The beginning and most of the middle were excellent, but the ending was just sorta-blech as the added powers started reaching a crescendo and the characters started getting wibbly-wobbly. He's great at coming up with ideas and executing them, but connecting the ideas from one to another are where he stumbles; which really hurts long-term consistency.

Shrapnel · Post by **Shrapnel** » Mon Apr 29, 2013 5:47 pm

Yeah, he was. I try not to read too much into it, though.

And besides, Doctor Who has always had it's share of ups and down; I mean, look at the classic episode The Gunfighters: it was about the Doctor having a toothache and going to the old west and getting Doc Holliday to do help him while Peter Purves sings an off-key Western ditty.

Wait, what am I talking about? That's awesome.

Prak · Post by **Prak** » Mon Apr 29, 2013 5:52 pm

This seems relevant:

Winnah · Post by **Winnah** » Mon Apr 29, 2013 6:03 pm

The character Mickey was initially a device to illustrate the repercussions of going on an adventure with the Doctor. The effect of relationships on people left behind.

The character evolved. Mickey stopped feeling sorry for himself because his ex had moved on.

RE: Moffat

Moffat does have some great writing ability. I liked The Empty Child and the follow up episode. I also liked Blink and the Forest of the Dead.

All of those episodes were original and highly creative. The thing is, he had oversight when he was writing those episodes, someone to give him critical feedback and force a certain standard.

He has created some memorable moments and scenes with Matt Smith's Doctor, but few entirely good episodes, as far as I am concerned. I think it is because he does not have someone looking over his shoulder.

Prak · Post by **Prak** » Mon Apr 29, 2013 6:08 pm

The problem with Mickey is that the spurned lover needs to be at least as interesting and attractive as the person their SO moved on to.

Count Arioch the 28th · Tue Apr 30, 2013 2:21 am

That doesn't make sense. If the spurned lover was as interesting and attractive as the new person, the lover wouldn't have been spurned in the first place.

Prak · Post by **Prak** » Tue Apr 30, 2013 3:16 am

I mean for the audience to care about them. It was the same problem with Rory until he started being badass devoted and doing shit. Mickey and early Rory were just "that guy who pops up occasionally, fawns over, complains to the real companion, and basically is shit warmed over on a stick, and makes you want the Doctor to just shove them out an airlock before ravishing their girl."

Winnah · Post by **Winnah** » Tue Apr 30, 2013 3:56 am

So the problem with Mickey, is that a working class mechanic from London is not as interesting as a thousand year old, time travelling alien...

I don't think that is the problem. I am not sure that the addition of romantic subplots between the Doctor and his companions was a great move for the show.

Humanising the Doctor seems to detract from the enigma of the character and no amount of chest thumping speeches or titilating references to the crimes that removed his true name, can restore that mystery once it has been lost.

Prak · Post by **Prak** » Tue Apr 30, 2013 4:23 am

It's not about job, or income level, or race, it's about Mickey not being an interesting character. Fuck, I didn't even know he was a mechanic, they should have played that up.

Count Arioch the 28th · Tue Apr 30, 2013 4:56 am

I don't like romantic subplots. If I am not watching a romance genre show/movie/whatever I do NOT want romantic subplots farting up what I am watching. I can hear the sounds of thousands of fingers clacking on keyboards ready to tell me I am a misogynist and I am an imbecile and I am delusional and my attitude today justifies things that happened in the past, so stifle it. Too many forms of media have romance subplots even when it makes no sense at all.

Whipstitch · Post by **Whipstitch** » Tue Apr 30, 2013 5:56 am

Count Arioch the 28th wrote:I can hear the sounds of thousands of fingers clacking on keyboards ready to tell me I am a misogynist...

My fingers are clacking a bit, but only because equivocating something rather harmless like "I don't like romantic subplots" with some of the other crap you've said in the past comes off as a bit of resentful sleight of hand which implies that criticisms you've received were all equally nit-picky. Before that you were fine.

But, anyway, yeah, there's shit tons of boring ass romantic subplots out there, particularly in genre fare. In a lot of sports and mob movies the only dividing line between good and bad guys is often a question of loyalty and fair play, so a lot of the times the token girl is dragged out to remind everyone which morally ambiguous character is capable of wuv. It's like dog kicking, only longer and way more boring.

Winnah · Post by **Winnah** » Tue Apr 30, 2013 7:33 am

I can only think of one character interesting enough to compete with the Doctor for someone's affections.

Ace Rimmer

What a guy!

As for romance...I think it does occasionally have a place. Examine the Family of Blood episodes. The blooming romance of John Smith paints a stark contrast of the Doctors character, when he finally drops his disguise and gives the Family each terrible versions of the immortality they were seeking.

As fluff and filler? No. That can fuck right off. If I want to watch vapid, flirtatious banter between undeveloped or one dimensional characters, Í can watch numerous other programs.

Prak · Post by **Prak** » Tue Apr 30, 2013 7:36 am

You forget Capt. Jack Harkness, and whatever the lesbian reptile lady's name is.

Count Arioch the 28th · Tue Apr 30, 2013 7:41 am

Whipstitch wrote:
Count Arioch the 28th wrote:I can hear the sounds of thousands of fingers clacking on keyboards ready to tell me I am a misogynist...
My fingers are clacking a bit, but only because equivocating something rather harmless like "I don't like romantic subplots" with some of the other crap you've said in the past comes off as a bit of resentful sleight of hand which implies that criticisms you've received were all equally nit-picky. Before that you were fine.

I communicated my feelings well then.

Artless · Post by **Artless** » Tue Apr 30, 2013 8:27 am

Superior Spider Man. The whole event, really, but this week was particularly repulsive.

It's like, goddammit, Slott. How many times do you think you can shoot someone's puppy in the mouth before people stop paying you out of anger to do it? Everyone knows where this event is headed, so stop trying to hate-fuck your detractors and just get the damn thing over with for fuck's sake.

I can only hope that sales start to lag sooner rather than later so we can put this embarrassing nonsense behind us and get on to the next dumb, embarrassing event in comics.

Winnah · Post by **Winnah** » Tue Apr 30, 2013 11:20 am

Prak_Anima wrote:You forget Capt. Jack Harkness, and whatever the lesbian reptile lady's name is.

I try to.

Captain Jack is a fully developed character that got a spin off show, Torchwood. If I want slasher monster of the week and pansexual orgies, I watch Torchwood. Not my favorite show, but I have watched a few episodes.

Lesbian reptile lady is an undeveloped character. A Mary Sue. A crime fighting dinosaur warlord in Victorian era London. Could have been a good character, but instead the focus seems to be on name dropping (she ate Jack the Ripper and inspired A.C.Doyle to write Sherlock Holmes), the in-your-face lesbianism in a sexually repressed culture and how she is super-best-friends with the Doctor, despite the limited amount of screen time she has had.

Instead of building a rapport with the audience over time, you get a hamfisted attempt at a backstory dump, spiced with her wife cooing over the 2 foot long tongue of lizard ninja lady.

Both are Moffat characters. Guess which one he wrote with a Lead Writer making revisions?